Society for Intercultural Education, Training and Research

As I wrote this I realized a large part of the experience was being in the powerful presence of Dr Reyes. Which the words don’t fully convey. I hope you can get a sense of this remarkable man and the conversation brought forth by Peggy. Thanks to Esther Louie (SIETAR-USA past president in photo center) for recommending her colleague.

Peggy Pusch (PP) started by asking Dr Reyes (RR) to tell the audience who he is.

RR: I’m a GED to PhD. How do I know that I know who I am? First and foremost my maybe esoteric organizing framework, I am spirit in earth body. My father is from the second Mesa, Hopi nation, sun clan. I’m a father, husband, educator, recovering Catholic. My Mexican Catholic mother is happy that I work between priests.

PP: What drew you into the work?

RR: Being drafted. Birth to death, it’s part of who I am, although I wonder about the spiritual significance of difference. What is ground truth? Why would it take courage? Aliveness, how can it be activated for greater good? It’s never separate.

When I was a kid of 5 or 6 I had a significant experience. Another child had leg braces, he was in the bathroom and other kids were picking on him and pushed him down. I intervened, the teachers came in. I knew it was wrong, and I needed to do something. I got in trouble.

PP: I lived in the segregated south in Baltimore. An African American family moved in and was forced to move out. I asked questions, and was told I would grow up to understand, but I never did. I also had a Japanese friend in elementary school, and my friend was visited every week. I asked why, I didn’t understand, and I still don’t like it.

PP: I understand you had something to do with the conference subtitle?

RR: Ester Louie and I were drinking by the river in Spokane, talking. I like alliteratives. We started playing around with courageous conversations and caring. We talked about Carol Gilligans work on moral development, and how she brought a female perspective in contrast to Kohlberg through stories. The waitress was listening, and she added create. So we had Courageous Conversations Create Caring Communities

We held a 5 C’s speaker series at Gonzaga talking about the naked truth, holding respect and civility to listen to opposing view. At a Jesuit University, it was about sexual orientation.

PP: Tell us more about your university life.

RR: I’m in an office between two Jesuit priests, where I have been for 20 years. I used to teach teachers, now I am an administrator, Associate Academic Dean for Diversity. I couldn’t do the work that was needed for students, faculty, staff, and administrators.

I now report directly to the President. We aren’t cut from the same philosophical cloth. Almost like an allergic reaction to me. He appreciates my ability to speak truth to the face of power, as Cornell West says, but like many people with more power and privilege, it is a tad uncomfortable.

I do a lot of intercultural relations and typical domestic ethnicity. I work in a predominantly white institution. I’m weary with the word diversity. It’s been co-opted by the left and the right. Doesn’t describe what you are FOR. Intercultural relationship describes what you are for. When I did diversity, I felt like I was wearing a scarlet letter. When I spoke up, people would dismiss me. It was like wearing the “D”iversity. If white guy says it, everyone listens and affirms. Felt like I was sniveling. I got road weary.

I’m heading to an NAACP event with the university president. The enduring conflict is good for me, and I want to believe it’s good for him too. It’s compost, gives opportunity to listen. How do I open the heart so mind can open? Jesuits are interested in words, origins through Greek and Latin. To have integrity, I am opening to integrate what is in heart and mind in congruence with behavior. What you profess is to be the person you pretend to be is how I interact with him. Humility and resilience, I need to bring both to this type of relationship.

PP: How do you continue?

RR: Happens in ceremony or faith life, spirituality, not limited by human ego. Cultures have different ceremonies whether spiritual or secular. We were going at it, I was trying to get LBGT center at Jesuit University. He was not supportive, but I was not intimidated. I’m not in fear. Everyone else is afraid, but I don’t care. He yelled at me. I said you don’t have to yell at me, and said we need to pray. To say the Our Father together, and it changed the energy.

Resilience comes from cultural identity activating symbolic life. Joseph Campbell and Carl Jung, symbols change energy. The other side to this side, the metaphysical to physical. Allows the ability to be resilient. Humility comes from earth foundation and strength.

When I am introduced, I often sing a song. Who are you? Where does the song come from? Ceremonial life. People say I have no culture, only people of color seen as having culture. But we all have culture, whether spiritual or sacred to assist in instances of personal integrity.

When I got into the others language of prayer, I morphed into the other. Like a Vulcan mind meld. I bend into others consciousness.

PP: I talked about sneaking out from my Protestant preacher Dad to see the Catholic church to a Jesuit brother. He said, “your poor father”. I had to think about it. Many of us have lost the rituals of our lives other than weddings and funerals.

RR: The common experience of creation is important. I don’t believe there is sacred and secular, I believe it is all sacred. The active presence of God in all things. How do we engage? How can we co-create? Becomes ceremonial.

Language is integrity, like Ed Hall talks about dictating world view. If you know culture, you know culture. Cultural DNA embedded in language. There are 550 tribes speaking 330 languages on the North American continent.

In communication something holy passes between us. Fire, air, earth, water. There is sacred air running through earth body. Significant implications, ritualized behavior takes on new meaning. Pray for things, practice relatedness, listen to goodness in ceremonies like vision quest, sun dance, moon times etc. If in the language, prayers give you orientation about relationship, and have medicine for conflict when it arrives.

Don’t necessarily have to know the words to get the feelings of receptive. Activates different energy, changes the climate, the weather.

I believe intercultural work is taking on a new meaning. Not like the new age, there will be value at looking at it more holistically. How metaphysical and physical are related beyond? What will it take? Literacy in ‘Race, Religion and Resources’ not ‘Reading, Writing and Arithmetic’. Need work in spiritual literacy, emotional intelligence so we can construct multiple ways to knowing.

We are alchemists as interculturalists.

Earlier, Dr Reyes mentioned he had recently cut off his braids. One of the audience members asked him to talk more about it.

It’s spiritual, cultural, and a desire to be disembodied. I didn’t want it to define who I am. I had a series of dreams I couldn’t deny, and I believe in the power and significance of dreams.

My great uncle died, who was the oldest on both sides of my family. In some of our traditions, when this happens you cut your hair, or give up something for a year. So I cut my hair to experience a cultural practice rather than just talk about it. I didn’t want to.

When people see me some say I have assimilated, or I am a sell out, or I have done it so I can get higher pay, or that I am not an Indian anymore. Some say I look younger, and I say tell me more Some say I see you through God’s eyes.

Our world is so fixated on carbon base reality. On the first impression. I’m frustrated by it, and want to midwife a new way to see it and be in the world, with all of reality. To see people as mysteries not problems. To empower knowingness, learn FROM not ABOUT.

It’s a spiritual exercise, humbled by not getting so much attention from my hair. I got seduced. It’s about humility. What is ego? Full in love with it so it no longer had power over me. All I want is to be seen and hear. To recognize, appreciate and encourage others to be who they are destined to be. Servant leadership. Allow people to be more complete.

With braids people weren’t seeing me. The brighter the light the less you see the window. So I don’t know if I’ll grow the braids back. I didn’t know how much time it took, now it’s easy to take care of hair. I’ll pray on it, but I’m being seen and heard differently. I did a ceremony to burn my braids, which had power. I’ve now integrated that power, so I don’t know if I need the braids.

Another audience member asks: How do you move beyond victimization and guilt, move beyond racism and genocide?

RR: Listen to each other, the retelling of stories, becoming enmeshed. It’s the nature of people, an intrinsic way of loving.

How can reconciliation heal trauma? People have a hard time:

• responding to hate with love
• admitting you are wrong when you are wrong
• including the excluded

White men just can’t go there. But we can teach children this. So we remember and don’t revictimize.

I was raised by women, my Mexican Catholic Mom. I have passion, I am quick to tears, a cry-baby. I like it. My Mom gave me permission.

To wrap up, Dr Reyes recommended a book: Buddha in Redface by Eduardo Duran

Dr Reyes is the Associate Vice President for Diversity at Gonzaga University.